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365 Responses to “550 Reader Comments on Dr Carver’s ‘Loser’ Article”
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Ann
271It has been 13 months since I told my ex that he needed to leave and it has been seven months since we were divorced.
Like most of these types of relationships, he moved in with me and my son three months after we started dating and we were married within seven months of dating.
The only way I could describe the six years that we were together was pure hell. The man was soooo sick. I couldn’t do anything without his permission. Even though he didn’t come right out and say that I needed his permission, he would make me feel guilty for not asking.
He was totally paranoid. Would interrogate me if I parked the car differently, got the mail when I usually didn’t get it, deleted a telephone message before he listened to it, took a bath when I usually took a shower, etc. Finally, one day I told him that he was delusional and paranoid. He told me that he wasn’t paranoid, but that I created suspicion. Apparently because I’m not a consistant person, I created suspicion. It came to a point where I was so sick and tired of this interrogation that I would finally told him to shut up. When I would start fighting back he would move to physical abuse, like pulling my hair, blocking my way from leaving, and his big one was to trap me in the kitchen and push me as hard as he could into the counter. One time after an arguement I was lying on my side facing the wall and he kneed me in my lower back. The pain brought tears to my eyes and all I could think of was what I had done to deserve this treatment. Another time I had woken up during the night and was just lying in bed and he hit me in the face with his fist. I thought, well maybe he’s sleeping and did it on accident. So I just turned over and listened to see if he actually was awake. I heard him clear his throat and got out of bed, then I knew he was awake and hit me on purpose.
He was a complete control freak, perhaps even where he worked. In the six years that we were together it only worked 2 1/2 of them. He worked three different places and every place he worked he accused the management and/or co workers of conspiring against him. If they didn’t do things his way it was the wrong way.
Nothing was ever enough. According to him he couldn’t feel my love. He didn’t believe that I loved him. Though I would tell him it quite often, showed him affection, told him positive things about himself, he said it didn’t matter, he didn’t feel my love. Out of frustration one time, I told him he was a bottomless pit, that no one could ever fill him up. (I think I got my hair pulled on that one.)
Toward the end of the relationship he was getting me further and further in debt and kept promising that he was going to get a job. I had taken out a $10,000 loan from my retirement and $21,000 home equity loan that was half gone in a month time. He paid off his credit cards with some of the money. Around the same time my son’s father started paying child support and I asked my husband if half of the child support could go into a savings account for my son. He got angry and believed that all of the child support should go to support the entire household. I didn’t think so. I couldn’t allow my son’s only chance of having a savings go to support his lazy ass. I was adamant. That night when I came home from work he had opened up his own checking account, gave me the joint checking account with all of the bills that needed to be paid. His entitlement was so great that he felt that he shouldn’t have to pay for any utilities such as lights, gas, phone, etc. His thinking was that I needed to have these utilities for myself and son anyway he shouldn’t have to pay for them. He also thought this way when it came to dinner dishes. He would pick up his own plate, glass, silverware and put them in the dishwasher but never helped with cleaning up the pots and pans. Why? Because I would have had to dirty them anyway for me and my son.
For the next eight months I allowed this to go on. I paid everything. While he bought a boat, a dirt bike, several used vehicles. Actually he bought quite a bit of stuff that didn’t make much sense.
Finally realization set in. I said to myself that if I allow this to go on I will have no self respect what so ever. So I told him that he needed to leave and leave he did. I had very little contact with him once he left. He filed for divorce two months after. It didn’t matter to me if we were divorced or not, I just wanted him out of my house. It had to be all about him all the time. At times I feel like yelling “”FREEDOM”" like Mel Gibson did in Braveheart.
Choices that we make in life have their pros and their cons. I did and still do miss him once in awhile, but that comes with healing. Things need to hurt in order for them to heal. I think that he believed that I couldn’t make it without him. That I was afraid of being alone. But I’m not alone. I have my son, my family and friends.
One thing that I needed to keep telling myself was to “Hold your head up and say see, I loved you, but I didn’t need you.”
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Diane
272Hi Mark,
Wow…. Your post was very articulate. And I am sorry for the pain you are going through. It is really hard to get clear and own what’s yours and know what isn’t your’s in these types of relationships. Personally I don’t agree that anyone is to be blamed for physical abuse like her brother believes. There is no way anyone deserves physical or emotional abuse. That we be like saying a child’s angry tempar tantrum is an excuse to beat him. So I hope that brings clarity there.
As far as the fact that she would go back to him that is so sad and is part of the Stockholm Syndrome that happens. If you haven’t read that article here, you should. And I would definately worry about her sons safety… and hers. Though since you’re trying to distance yourself. You’ll have to make some decisions about the help you could supply her. Are you still talking to her or her family? You might want to provide her family info. from here and the web address. And you could even give it to her? But that’s a judgement call on your part. It’s such a tragedy considering you have a loving bond to her child. That has got to be gut wrenching for you.
Since she was coming out of an abusive relationship alot of her interaction with you has been clearly part of defense machanisms she aquired from that relationship. Even people who don’t have abuse do argue or debate things??? So I guess its about arguing in a healthy way. The lesson that would been good for her as far as your relationship was concerned. But that is not the point anymore.
I’ll be reading the other posts now. Hope you gain the clarity you need.
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Diane273
Hi Mark,
Just read through all your posts and everyone elses…
It really is hard position for you to be in. It is clear that her son means the world to you. Consider this: You could call child support services if you hear one report of violence. It is highly unlikely that this physical abuse will not happen. Sometimes in life we have hard choices to make you know… and this young childs life may need a concerned advocate??? Many people shy away from this type of thing? And she is allredy a victum of abuse… so you can not count on her to the right thing. Though it is not your responsiblity yiu might consider this option. And I for one think you should thouroughly consider this. Is there anyone you trust in her family that you could talk to about her son… Kids need people to care… That’s where I come from in this.
Your words in that post say you CARE about him. So think about that there are hotlines in your area and you could just call and explain the issue and get there advice as well.
I agree you should stay away from her as well. And always remember IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT! It is not about YOU! And you did not create this.
The feelings you express are definately normal and all of us here have them. And we all have to find a way to deal appropriately with them so we can gain our strength back. Hang in there and take care of yourself first and foremost.
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margaret
274Mark – you are going through the awful, tormenting phase that every victim of a loser experiences…trying to figure out the “how, what, when, where, why”. It will drive you mad. The sooner you get beyond that, the better off you will be. In my case, it took a year and a half, until I was helped by an anti-depressant. Now I look at it as time absolutely, completely wasted…my life did not advance one single little bit. Believe me when I tell you, you do not want that. Also, I think you are idealizing your role in the child’s life and the solution of adoption. In reality, if you adopted him, you would now be in a long, ugly, expensive, protracted custody battle…and it’s very unlikely you would win. What’s more, you would be paying child support for the next 15 years. I know you feel for him but there are some things you can’t help. Presumably he has grandparents and uncles who are invested in his safety. Although I have much respect for Diane’s input, I don’t totally agree with her on this one. While NO ONE deserves abuse, especially physical, abuse doesn’t turn a kind person into an abuser. If anything, it tends to make the abused party depressed, fearful and timid. I think these two are a case of “water seeking its own level”.
You’re hoping they will break up. They will. But when they do, be well on your way. I took my x back after he broke up with the woman after me. He hadn’t changed at all. They never do, in spite of their words to the contrary. It wasn’t what I had hoped for at all. It was more of the same – torment and misery. I used to lie in bed and think: “She got away. Now I’m stuck”. Don’t let your heart and your ego lead you into turbulent waters. Be careful what your wish for. -
margaret275
Ann – he is a very sick guy but thankfully, you sound like you have your head on straight. He is classic in his behavior…control, can’t keep a job, financial catatstrophe, drama, lies, blame-shifting (making everything your fault)…it’s all there. Did you know anything about his history? any red flags before he moved in? was he working then?
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Diane276
Hi Ann,
That’s an amazing life story. You are a an amazing woman. Wow!!!
What an inspiration to others. That you can stop the abuse, and move on and heal. I loved your comments and statements you used to remind yourself on who you truly are. How you stood firmly on your values and did it! How you broke FREE and gained a healthy life back. I’d celebrate that too. Thanks so much for sharing with all of us. -
Ann277
Diane and Margaret – Thanks for your wonderful comments.
Yes he had a job when he moved in with us but when he was told that he had to go onto second shift he quit it. He said that he would always be wondering what I was going to be doing while he was on second shift. He didn’t trust me and I had never gave him any reason not to.
There was quite a few red flags but he always made me believe that it was me. If I could change things would get better. It wasn’t until he started working for my sister and brother in law that the truth finally came out. He would treat my sister the same way. She would call me crying because of things he would say to her. How he would get in her face with gritted teeth to express his anger when she would not be submissive. Even though it was my sister and her husband’s business, my ex felt that he should have total control of the business. He did not like taking orders from her. In fact, he doesn’t like taking orders from anybody.
Once my sister told me this it was like the fog lifted. I could see the trees through the forest. It’s not all me, it never was. That’s when I made my plans, changing and closing bank accounts. When I finally told him that he needed to leave, I felt like a great weight was lifted from my shoulders.
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Mark
278Hello Diane,
Thank you for your feed back.
My problem with child services is that, how terrible would it be for this child to be taken away from his mother, she is not the greatest mother (she drove drunk with him in the car once and 1 time I heard her say, “shut up before I kill you” to him) now, the second is a mistake people make, the first drinking and driving is no excuse! Not to mention she is high 75 of the time. I just don’t know if taking a child away from his mother is better than hoping the child will not have to worry about the abuse (if there will be any to him, he may just be a witness to it) And no, I do not have anyone who can keep an eye on him, as they live 2 hours away from me – the only thing I could do is contact someone at his school and give them a warning of what may happen in the future because they do not know the background to the biological father.
Margaret,
I agree that the abuse did not turn her into an abusive person.
I look at it this way when it comes to abusers ever changing. Do nice people tend to change? nope, more than likely a nice person will generally be a nice person throughout their whole life, they will not turn into someone abusive. Same goes the other way around, once an abuser, almost always an abuser.
As far as being careful what I wish for, I would feel good knowing she was with a nice person, not going back to someone abusive…
I have been there with her too, taking her back I would wake up some mornings and ask myself, how can I do this for the rest of my life?I wish she just had the strength to be on her own for a while, so she can sort out her own issues and create a healthy future for her son. Like I said, I would not take her back (I pray I have the strength to never take her back be it 5 months 5 years down the road) But I do want to see her do well.
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Diane279
Mark,
Have you ever considered the fact that this may wake her up a bit? Please at least contact the school at least. You know they don’t necsarily remove the child right away an investigation happens first. And this may also make the physical abuser get scared and leave. Having the abuse out in the open with authorities looking into it may be a benefit to this child more than a adverse case scenario. Maybe you should write Dr. Carver at just ask a psychologist. By law if he new her he would have to call it in. Catch my drift….And know these are only suggestions…
About the topic your discussing with Margaret.. it really can go both ways. A person can have some behaviors they would not have if they were not a victim of abuse. At least that’s what I have learned here and at another site on physical and emotional abuse. There are traits that one could pick up from their own family and/or relationship of abuse. And they can also have behavior that have been pre-existing from birth as well. And personality disorders/loosers is about a persons who actively lives in wrong thinking. Look alot of healthy people get trapped into these inherantly bad living conditions. And healthy people do get affected by it, we are witnesses to this ourselves. It clouds a perfectly good persons sound perspective.
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Diane
280Hi Ann,
Wow… Talk about controlling!
Your statement the seeing between the trees and the weight being lifted off. Its amazing how clarity of a situation just leads the way to getting back to health. Isn’t it? All it took was one person reflecting “it” back to you and you could see the light. And learned it wasn’t YOU. That is so empowering to hear about. Thanks!
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