365 Responses to “550 Reader Comments on Dr Carver’s ‘Loser’ Article”

1. 

   Wendy

   261

   16th October 2008

   Hi Clara!

   I’m so glad you didn’t go! Thanks for posting.
2. 

   Diane

   262

   17th October 2008

   Clara,

   Me too! Glad you didn’t go.
3. 

   Mark

   263

   19th October 2008

   I have a question, if anyone can please help I would really appreciate the feedback, thanks in advance.

   I dated an emotional abuser, who once dated and is now again dating a physical abuser. (how destructive)

   A little bit of back ground.

   First of let me say that my ex grew up with an abusive father, not physical, but verbal abuse. Her parent’s were destructive throughout their 20 years in marriage, constantly threatening to break up and divorce. Definitely not the healthiest environment to grow up in, they finally divorced when my EX was 16. She is now 30. About 10 years ago her mother tried to kill herself, she got out of it and turned her life around, is doing great now.

   Now on to her personal destruction. She has been smoking pot for a long time, not just occasionally, but everyday. In her early 20′s she got addicted to ritalin (she has ADHD) really messed up her life, dropped out of school, she was working towards her masters degree at this point, started dating a guy who liked to drink, smoked pot, grew pot, but was also physically abusive. but on her word he was very passionate (when time were good, they were really good) so after 8 months together she got pregnant by this man.

   Somewhere during this time she kicked her ritalin addiction and started to sober herself back up – minus the pot (I’m sure she stopped smoking while pregnant, but started back up after giving birth).

   Eventually she ended up leaving this man because while they were together they would argue a lot, he blew snot in her face, made her kiss his feet in apology, grabbed her when they would argue, and kicked her in the back when she was 3 months pregnant – just to name a few things – so she left him.

   She lived with her mom during pregnancy, had the child, abusive father was not put on the birth certificate, but her and him were still in contact at that point, not living together but on and off, eventually she decided enough is enough after one day he comes to visit her, they argue and he grabs her.

   I knew her at this point, we worked together, and a while after they finally broke it off we started dating (just under 3 years ago).

   She wouldn’t let the real father see his child, he wasn’t paying child support, basically she broke herself free from this man, he tried to get her back a couple times, but she wasn’t having it, she was also with me at this point.

   Fast forward a couple years – I play a huge role in her child’s life – I came into it when he was only 13 months, he called me daddy, because that’s all he knew me as. She is doing well, she finished her masters degree, now has a great career earning over 60k/year, her son is doing great growing up to be a nice young little boy (he’s almost 4).

   Our relationship wasn’t nice, too many arguments, this girl loved to argue. I argued more with her in 2 and a half years than everyone in total in my entire life – While she loved to argue, if not with me, with co-workers, with her mother, going months without speaking with her friends due to some ridiculous reason that started arguments, just constant drama. Bottom line is – As much as I hate to admit it, she was verbally abusive to me, and I don’t know why I put up with it, She was very nice at times, but there were times when she would say things such as (I wish you were on the same education level as me…try and leave me, see if you can find anyone better, do you think any of your friends are having better sex that you, constantly tried to make me jealous, everything was my fault – EVERYTHING, would sometimes criticize the way I spoke, I would take her pot away because I didn’t want her to smoke and she would tell me she hated me, then all of the sudden to try to get it back she would love me, a lot of small but hurtful belittlement and nothing was good enough no matter how hard I tried there was always something new that wasn’t good enough) Anyway, this list can go on and on.

   Back in march – I became very distant for a couple weeks after our 2 year anniversary where she made it up in her mind that I was going to propose, so she freaked out – we were at dinner and she proposed a toast “cheers to not getting married” – and said “I love you and you are the best dad but I need you to be making a lot of money” (her parents are pretty wealthy so ya, shes pretty spoiled) Anyway, guess how that made me feel? lol
   Thanks for basically telling me I’m great but without making a lot of money I’m pretty much worthless, 2 weeks later she broke up with me after an argument.

   During our break up she really put in effort to find someone else, online dating, her mother trying to find someone for her, whatever it was, she was unsuccessful. So after a few months she tried hard to get me back, really put in the effort, after ignoring her for a week I started to talk to her, and after talking to her she seemed to really have been putting effort to change, I needed changing too, but she said she was smoking pot way less, was going to therapy, realized I’m the one she wants, I’m her best lover, I’m the best father (this I can agree with, people called me super dad even though he wasn’t my son I loved him as my own, lol) I love you so much, basically I was showered with all these nice things, wow the angry girl is not so angry anymore, maybe she IS putting in the effort.

   sidebar – sorry this is so long!

   So, we got back together, but I would not move back in with her, I wasn’t risking myself, for a couple months she tried hard to get me to move back, she would revert to her old ways, crying, arguing, tantrums,trying to make me feel guilty to try and get me to move back, I refused, at this point I told myself, ok this relationship is going to end very very soon, I regret getting back together with her and it’s not fair to her son because this is just screwing him up. I find out her so called therapy was physical therapy. She is showing no signs of smoking less pot, basically the same crap, of course I’m not perfect either because I’m not there being a full time dad or helping her pay for her bills. But I refuse to move back in with someone so quick when 6 months prior she said “cheers to not getting married”

   Basically I stayed strong and did no let her manipulate me into moving back in with her, I couldn’t because six months ago she didn’t want to marry me, now she is pushing for me to marry her,pushing for me to adopt her son, pushing for me to be something that wasn’t good enough for her half a year ago, it just seemed like no matter what I did it wasn’t good enough, or she wanted the exact opposite of what I was offering her. this bothered her enough to the point where once again we broke up.

   I’m sad about the break up, but I realize I deserve someone who is nice and caring and well, just not so crazy and addicted to anger, stress and obsessed with money and appreciates someone who treats her well. I may have said a few not so nice things when we would argue, but I would never belittle her or speak to her in disrespectful manners like she would often to me.

   Now the part that confuses me about her is that she is very dependent, and is terrified of being alone.

   So now she is back together with her abusive ex – It’s almost like she is so desperate to get married, that after 3 years of avoiding this man, swearing she would never go back to him, she is back together with him…He is in the child’s life – he didn’t even know his real dad, he thought I was, basically, they are in love all over again and he swears to have changed and what not, but she hasn’t changed, she still loves to push people buttons…bottom line is, what are you going to do the next time he kicks you in the back when you are pregnant again only this time your son is watching, or he hits your son just like he used to abuse your dog. It’s ridiculous.

   When we were together, her brother told me, It’s true about the abuse my sister took, he is that type of man but don’t forget that she helped push him to do those things.

   I’m glad that I am not with her but I don’t know why she would take this path?? Her parents hated him, she hated him, her friend’s hated him.

   Just like my parents, my friends didn’t like her and didn’t want me to be in a relationship with her.

   sorry this was so long and hopefully not so confusing, the more detail the better help I can get in understanding this.

   She is a very attractive girl, she is crazy and smokes pot, loves to argue and is a single mother – so yes it may be difficult for her to find someone, but why would anyone ever go back to abuse – especially after they made such progress escaping it??? is it because she is abusive herself???

   Myself, I feel sorry for her, and I feel sorry for her son and I hope everything works out well for them.

   But at the end of the day I still feel like my self esteem is shot because, she was verbally abusive with me, and basically when I didn’t let her control me anymore she replaced me with someone who was physically abusive to her.

   It makes me feel like – am I worse than an abuser?

   Will they work out in the end? I do not want her back, but what is in store for her son because I am concerned for him, he is a sweet little boy but does not deserve to have 2 destructive parents.

   is it possible for verbal abusers and physical abusers to feed of one another’s abuse, this is so confusing to me.

   any clarity would be appreciated, thanks.
4. 

   margaret

   264

   19th October 2008

   That is a train wreck in the making. The very fact that she doesn’t make her own child’s security and stability a priority speaks volumes. She is a troubled and troubling person. These are the crazy-makers, they turn your life upside down and leave you emotionally and spiritually exhausted. They suck the lifedblood out of you. Stay away. You cannot fix things or change her. Educate yourself to Narcissicism, Borderline Personality Disorder and Histrionic personality disorder. You will hear from her again…they never seem to fully go away. It may be a month, a year, or five years, but this isn’t the last of her. That is NOT good news for you unless you have the will to totally shut her out. She will never change. Why? She doesn’t think anything is wrong with her. With these people, it’s all “I’m okay. You’re not okay” I have no doubt that this new (or revisited) relationship will be abusive…people don’t change, and particulary abusers don’t change unless they seek and undergo INTENSIVE therapy…which they almost never do. They will abuse each other. Just hope it doesn’t end fatally. But for you…stay away. Far away. And stop wondering if you could have done anything differently, been any better. The answer is “no”. They thrive on drama and chaos. If you had made a squillion dollars, it would have been something else…how you parted your hair or brushed your teeth.
5. 

   Wendy

   265

   19th October 2008

   Hi Mark!

   I agree with Margaret, unfortunately. I don’t see this getting any better – it has all the earmarks of a situation that will suck you down as far as you will let it.

   Still, like me in my own situation, it sounds as if you’ve never been in so deep that you couldn’t see that this was crazy, in some sense, and feel you had to protect yourself and be a little objective. I think the only thing to do now is cut off all contact and go on to other, better things. I know it is your instinct to be kind to both this woman and her little boy, but unfortunately you have no avenues to do any good here.

   But boy, it’s preoccupying, isn’t it? These people are so self-destructive, and we try and try to make sense of them, for their own good as well as our sanity. But their world is so different from our own, we can never reconcile the two.

   Try to fill your time with other, positive things and thoughts, and the situation will gradually lose its hold on your emotions.

   Best wishes,
   ~Wendy
6. 

   Mark

   266

   19th October 2008

   Thank you for your reply Margaret,

   It is not a new relationship for her, it is with her son’s father (who the son only met a few times when he was under the age of one)

   My question is, how is it that someone that is verbally abusive (my ex) can escape the physical abuse of someone for nearly 3 years (her ex) and then return to them after realizing that her manipulations were no longer working on me the way they used to.

   I understand and I also feel as if I dodged a bullet, but I can’t help but take a shock to my confidence because at the end of it all, She chose an abuser over me, It makes me feel like, like I don’t have anything better to offer than someone physically abusive.

   You are right, it is a train wreck, but at the end of the day I still feel at a loss, and I still fear for the little one.
7. 

   Mark

   267

   19th October 2008

   Hi Wendy,

   I have cut off all contact, the last I heard from her she told me it was best that I continue to separate myself from her as right now that is best for everyone. (she doesn’t know that I know she is back with her ex)

   I agree with her, and I am staying strong. To be honest I lost a lot of respect for her, not for the fact that what she did to me, but for the fact that she herself went back to someone who beat her, It really speaks volumes about her character.

   I just wish I didn’t now feel like the whole 2 and a half years together was nothing but a lie, because at the end of it all, her heart still belonged to the abuser. I could be wrong, in her mind it could be that she is desperate for anyone to fill that void and since I would not give in to her wishes she reverted back to someone that she knew would be available.

   Bottom line is, any therapeutic responses are welcomed and appreciated.
8. 

   Wendy

   268

   19th October 2008

   Hi Mark!

   When it comes to therapeutic responses, what comes to my mind is that you should avoid comparing yourself to her abusive ex, and wondering why she seems to prefer him to you (wondering, “what does that make me?”).

   It has nothing to do with your merits or worth in the “sane” world. Her world is twisted. He has something she wants. On a weird level she may even want the abuse. It’s a world she knows.

   Once again, it has nothing to do with you.
9. 

   debbie

   269

   19th October 2008

   Hi mark
   I felt so very sad when I read your comment. You have been Dad to that little boy and you now feel helpless to do anything. And the sad thing is he is going to get caught up in their relationship and possibly be emotionally destroyed by it, but possibly not depending on his own little personality and strength. Lets hope not.
   sadly there is nothing you can do about that. And as you now realise there is no going back to that relationship that was any way damaging you.
   As for why she went back to her ex, well possibly because you were refusing to have her back and she was desparate to have some body…anybody. Don’t take it personally.
   As you said yourself she seemed to thrive off arguments and anger, so who better to do this with than her abusive ex. They are obviously co dependent.
   Do not blame your self although I know it is hard. All of us on here have had those same feelings.
   Good luck
10. 

    Mark

    270

    19th October 2008

    Thank you everyone for your comments, I really appreciate it.

    As bad as this may sound because I hate to think of anyone having to go through abuse of any form, it helps to read others stories. Gives me hope and helps me feel like I’m not so alone.

    My only regret is not adopting this child when she had asked me to do so, which may sound ridiculous because most people would not adopt a child that is their ex’s. But I feel like if I did then I could have prevented him from being reunited with his abusive biological father. Now he’s got a verbally abusive mom and a physically abusive dad. Which eats me up inside.

    What are the chances of these two working out? I know the term, if you love something let it go, if it comes back its yours to keep – which of course is just an old saying, but at the same time, I do not want them to work out – not for my benefit because I promised my friend the other day that if I ever go back to her then I’m selling him my soul – I’m that determined to stay away! But I do not want this child growing up in this type of environment at all, no one deserves it and he is such a sweet little guy.

    All I know is they are rushing to live together again withing a few months, at which point I think the honey moon phase will slowly start to ware off and true colors will slowly start to show up. I know it is out of my control but I fear that it’s bad enough that they have on child that’s going to have to live with it, there is a good chance they will bring another child into the world.

    I don’t understand people who are so delusional to their own behavior.

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