Comments on “More on Relationship Losers, Abusers, Manipulators and Controllers”
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218 Responses to “More on Relationship Losers, Abusers, Manipulators and Controllers”
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debbie100
Hi Brooke
I have just read about your situation. I have also just written about mine. I have a baby with my ex husband and am going through divorce. He was so desparate for a baby with me, but didn’t get involved when I was pregnant or afterwards. Since splitting, he was offered access to see the baby without me present and he didn’t turn up for it. I have also found out that he has had a child with his first wife and he didn’t tell me. He disowned this child. I think these men have children with you to control you, not cos they care for the child. Today he was outside my house asking me to wave at the window if I wanted him to go. I made no response so he went away and came back with the children from his ex saying they wanted to see the baby. I rang my neighbour and as soon as he saw her he left. I am organising access through a lawyer who says its better if I’m not there. We are looking into contact centres. I suggest that you don’t speak to your ex at all. If he doesn’t want to see your child then so be it. It will be better for her in the long run and he is never going to support you. He is just still driving you mad. If he wants to see your child arrange it with a third party in a safe environment. Can you use a contact centre? I also understand your frustration about support. I have no money and have had to go through the government to receive a pittance from him. He has changed his car and has a new girlfriend. At the end of the day we are better off without them and so are our chidren. Its sad, and we have to come to terms with it in time. I hope this is helpful
Debbie -
brooke99
I have just read your article on “the loser”. It is so much like my ex, its scary. I was with him for 6 years, and its sad to say it took me that long to understand he would not change. But reading your article, it put a new perspective on things for me.. I know he is not good for me, but still feeling of “why” always in my head. Many times we break up, and then he pulls me back. Always so nice, always going to change and we should go to counseling, and blah blah blah.. Then it happens, hes the same, crazy insane and then as sweet as anyone could ever want in a person. back and forth. TO the point that i would wait for the nice part to come and just love it, and think how it was all worth it, and we would be ok. Heres the only thing in my situtaion, is that we have a daughter, who is 3. And he uses her to make me feel bad, or to keep me with him. He never has had much to do with her, living with him or not, never watched her or kept her without me. So now i just learned on top of all of this, she is austic! So talk about emtional breakdown. And as soon as this happended, he had a new girlfriend with kids living with him within a month! about every three weeks, he will make contact telling me how its all my fault he never sees his daughter, amoung other things he blames me for. But this time, i dont believe him like in the past, and i express that to him. He comes back with he will just leave the state, or run his van over a cliff, or he will just pay all the money he owes in child support so wont see him, and i say good, when? and he gets mad, and it never happens, and this goes on and on. I dont know how to move on from him, because im so mad that he replaced his daughter, and that he has no responsibilities. And im left tryin to pull myself together, and work full time, be a single mom and take my daughter to countless doctors and thearpy and classes. Any advice would be greatful. ~
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debbie98
Dear Dr Carver
I last wrote on the Stockholm Syndrome blog - I think no 83 0n 12 September. Your response to me was very helpful, and I look at it to remind me to keep being strong. I will explain briefly that I met J on the internet. He said he was half Italian, had 2 children had been married once before but she had been a bigamist.All his family were in Italy. He was wonderful and charming. He cooked for me wrote love notes etc. Wanted to marry me very quickly and was desparate to have a child with me. We got married very quickly and I fell pregnant straight away. J’s behaviour changed fairly quickly after marriage. He had nasty moods when I didn’t do what he wanted.I was looking after him and kids from the previous marriage and I was pregnant and working.I was supporting him financially. His dog trashed the garden, and then he said he would help me make it nice if I put him on the deeds of my house.He was making my boys from a previous marriage run around doing chores for him. He was jealous of my relationship with them and didn’t want me to cuddle them.He didn’t like my family and tried to limit access. He looked through my phone and asked what I had been talking about. Eventually he went onto the deeds of my house when he kept saying he woldnt help me with any bills on the house or practical help with the house until I did. Yet when he was in a good mood he was lovely. Eventually I left with our 5 week old baby. He has bombarded me with phone calls and texts which I have ignored.At first he threatened suicide, he’d been in a car crash, admited to hospital etc I changed my phone numbers and I am now getting letters. All designed to make me feel guilty. All claiming he has done nothing wrong.Wanting me back. He told me in his last letter that he has a new girlfriend.I have also discovered that I am his 4 wife and that he has at least one other child.He is also half greek and his family live in london. His dad committed suicide.Despite all this I can relate to Nancy, how difficult it is not to give in and go back.I would like to tell you what i sometimes do when I need to be strong.I look in the mirror and speak to myself and tell myself that I am strong, or other words that keep me strong. I am lucky that my family are very supportive and I have a good lawyer! -
Robin97
Ijust read “Are you dating a Loser” I think I’m married to one after reading this because my heart rate has increased and i’m really afraid in emailing this comment to you because my husband and I share this computer..I’m even thinking of ways to delete my recent history on the net..we have been married for 10 years and one child age 7..almost everything in your article is the way I feel my husband behaves…i have threaten divorce several times based on his verbal abuse and physical pushy behavoir…I’m scared, he has in the past threatened my life…dammed me to hell, put Meth in my coffee,,just very ugly words come out and then we are back on good time,,A roller coster
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Johnny96
Dr. Carver,
Your article about ‘loser’ types was wonderful.
When I read it, I was able to identify my ex-girlfriend as a loser type. I was the one who break it up, but I still have trouble letting go. Relationship was very intense, both love and misunderstandings were at high level.
My 6-year relationship ended two months ago (both about 30 years, no kids). We were not married, but lived together for last two years.
She was quarrelsome, selfish, narcissistic, rude, pesimistic, possessive, hostile to my parents. Why then I was with her? Well, she also was clever, responsible, diligent, serious, she cleaned and maintained the apartment, cooked, did other house jobs, planned childen (like I did). She had good taste, value system that corresponds with mine, we had
agreement about crucial thisng: where we are going to live, how much children will we have, what are our priorities in next five years.
I wonder, could this people realize their flaws and change themselves? Or at least controll themselves? I believe that clever people CAN see it own flaws and work on it. Or this is my ilusion? I protested for her behaviour and must admit she changed a bit. But I didn’t find solution for her last frustration – my parents.
For the last 3-4 months, she constantly complained to me that my parents offended her (although they hadn’t told her nothing special), that they don’t respect her opinion, interfere in our life (although we live 120 miles away from them), that I am under their influence, that they don’t like her, and so on. I could not understand that.I tried to explaine, I consoled her, I tried to assure her that nobody except us is going to make any decisions, that nobody hates od dislikes her, that if somebody disagree with her it does not mean that somebody disrespect her, that she has MY support, and nobody’s else’s support isn’t matter, and so on. I was talking and explaining for MONHTS. It didn’t worth. We stuck.
Desperate, I decided to break. I could not see a solution. She was desperate to hear that. We separated, but she still want reconcilation. I’m aware of her strong and weak points. I love her VERY much, but I am afraid of continuing.
Can she change? What should I do?
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Wendy95
Hi Nancy … I had a few thoughts, while you wait for Dr. Carver …
I really relate when you say, “Still I don’t know how to fully take it out of my heart”. That’s just how I felt, too. But these individuals act as if they don’t have a heart. They don’t seem to feel things the way most people do, and they leave us confused and sad.
My advice is, time is the best thing to take it out of your heart. Also, Dr. Carver’s article about “Emotional Memory” is very good. You can help time do its work if you make an effort not to dwell on bad memories. If we realize how our minds work, we can influence where our thoughts go, and how we are affected. In short, think about good things, and you’ll feel better immediately. Try it, it really works!
To help even more with this, try to resist going on the internet and checking what your ex is doing. This is sooo tempting, and you sit there hypnotized for hours and end up feeling like sh*t. Right? A lot of us on this forum have done this, and we know that it just makes us feel worse. So don’t sit there feasting on evidence that he doesn’t care. Turn it off. Go eat some cookies and watch TV. Call your friends. Go for a walk.
The worst is actually over.
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Nancy94
Dr . Carver,
I left my home I shared with my husband last Wednesday. Thanks to some advice and the warning of a therapist and a lady who specializes on women abuse, I was warned my Husband was a brisk away from getting into the physical abuse. Now then giving some background to the story 4 years ago I met him, He was true prince, wonderful sweet, althouth I admit I skiped the red flags. Since the begining he started throwing stuff, later he begin hurting himself, scissors, knife, belt, cables, hammer, his own fists, anything handy. We tried therapy, but it confused me to see none of the therapist ever touched the topic. I assumed it wasn’t that bad.
Through all this time I was sick, allergies, rashes, I had it all, but still I wasn’t aware of why I was so unhappy. Bottom line on August I found him having drinks with another woman in my house on late 2:00 am, in the morning, the woman left and he walked he to her car. I couldn’t handdle it and left. I went to my friend’s house, and she comfort me and help me to open my eyes, yet I wasn’t getting the full impact.
When I came back he had left, and came the next day, to pick up some of his stuff saying he neede some time and andthat seh was just a friend. He was gone for a week and I saw him the next Saturday when we make up. It was a real honey moon, like when we first meet.
Later that Tuesday he admited he stayed that week with the other woman (even he payed a moths rent of her appartment), saying they were just friends, I drove him, to her appartment to pick his stuff, it didn’t hit me what I did until I was at work. I felt like a idiot!
I call him at lunch and I saw that he was lying, I even got him to call the woman and get some explanation.
Bottom line I continued with the file of divorce and I wasn’t feeling ok. Although he sweared that divorce didn’t matter, we’ll work it out. That until Monday when he received the papers, he was ok, until in the evening he went to have dinner, and if I wanted to come, I’d have to pay myself. And that either I cancelled the divorce or return the money to the accounts (I had taken half of the money of the common as my lawyer adviced me,also his thing is the money).I refused and he left realy angry, but when he came back he was a sweet. Next day he was a sweet and we wnet to therapy together the therapist adviced to put the divorce on hold and finally I had made my desicion to go to Mexico without him to see my family. He agreed to it and all seem fine. The next day it was the day before I took the plane to Mexico, he called me all sweet during the day, until evening. It was then aroud 7:00 p.m he left a very angry and threating voice mail. I called back and he said something about a broken mirrow and that I had broken it. I freaked out but still went home hoping it wasn’t that bad. When I was there I saw the wall mirrow in the entrance broken in pieces (it was like 3 x 3 feet). I asked him what it had happened, he said that I had done it, I refused and even question him about it, then he throwed the items of the coffee table at me. In that moment I called the police and left the house. When the police came he still stated that I had broken the mirrow and they asked him to leave for the night. I waited my friends and they came to pick me up, got some stuff an went to Mexico. In my country I start feeling good about this, but then I begin to miss him and he called me and I called him, He said he wanted to work the things out. While in my country I fouind a therapist who warned me that he could be dangerous to me.
I came back and he was went to pick me to the airport, he was nice, yet he wanted me to admit the broken mirrow and I refused, but was still good. I admit Iwas very confused I wanted both, I wanted him to recover and live happily ever after. He still insited on the puting the divorce on hold, and I talked with my lawyer, she told me it wasnt a good idea and it might be a trick. And it proved to bew so, he wasn’t getting angry and anxious, he tried to push me saying we wouldn’t go to therapy unless I put the divorce on hold and at some point he threaten to call the police on me if I didn’t stop the conversation.
That and the talked with my lawyer, a meeting with other abused women, allowed me to see I was in danger.
We met his therapist on tuesday and even thoug he tried to be sweet, I decided to do my move, so while he was at work on wednesday, I moved out to a friend.
Now I’m my healing, I found this place, I’m realizing that he is an “loser” and abuser. Still I don’t know how to fully take it out of my heart. I have realized that one of the things thta hold me back to get back to him is that he must be thinking ho to punish me, that he is getting angry and he’ll fisnd tghe way to hurt me. How do I protect myself. Yesterday I saw his ad in my space, and it hurted me. I want to protect myself my emotiosn and feeling.
Please I need some guidance, howe can I amek this less painful, how do I avoid thinking on the romantic moments, how do I see the truth? -
Rob93
My wife was abused from the age of 8 to well into her teens. All of the abusers were family members. We have been married for over 10 years but I only found out about the abuse 5 years ago. She still welcomes the abusers into our home and interact with them in a relatively normal fashion which I find hard to cope with. She admits that her father was one of the abusers but this does not show at all in her manner when he visits. I am convinced that she has Stockholm syndrome or at least exibits the characteristics associated with this condition. She is seeing a psycologist who is only treating her for the deppression she suffers from. My wifes mood actually improves when visited by members of her family who have treated her very badly over the years. This is very hard to watch or understand and I am looking for something that will help my wife understand what effect this is having on ME and our two kids. We live in New Zealand and the health system in our area is very primitive, relatively speaking, and so the mention of Stockholm syndrome by me was not taken seriously I think. Can you help with ANYTHING PLEASE
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Ralph92
Dr. Carver: Thank you so much for opening my eyes. When me and my ex first started dating, it was wonderful, as it usually is. But soon thereafter, withing 2-3 weeks, she started to push for marriage. She told me that we were soul mates, and she even gave me a ring, which I thought was unusual. But then everything about her changed. She became cold, controlling, and verbally abusive. Everyone around me told me to get out, but I couldn’t see the light. I started to feel sorry for her. We kept breaking up, then getting back together. I should have let go a long time ago. Thanks again for helping me so much.
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91
Dear Ralph: Your ex doesn’t actually hate you. Her misery is totally related to her - not you. And a new partner doesn’t make a Loser happy. When everything is going their way, when they are in control, and when all their selfish demands are met - THEN they’re happy (for a short time). Losers have very shallow emotions - they don’t invest much of themselves in a relationship - so they can detach and move on very quickly. As Wendy mentions, it can happen so fast and with such emotional drama that the victim is left to ponder the what-happened? issues. The Loser isn’t pondering however - it’s off to the next target.
Ralph, you may hear from her again, especially if her current situation doesn’t work out the way she expects. Losers don’t feel guilt or obligation and for that reason, aren’t shy about recontacting you if it suits their needs. This is the “back burner” I talk about.
Normal, healthy folks experience a lot of confusion when we try to understand the behavior of a Loser using a “normal” emotional framework. We look at their antisocial behavior and think “That must really bother them to do that to me!” In truth - it doesn’t bother them at all. It only bothers them when they don’t get what they want, when their current scheme isn’t working, or they get caught up in their lies/behaviors. Criminals aren’t upset about their crime - they’re upset because they were caught and arrested. These folks think differently than we do.
You didn’t make her miserable. What you saw in the parking lot was the “core” personality - bitter, angry, resentful, etc. No courtesy, no manners, self-absorbed, and mad at the world. You caught her without her facade/mask. Many victims eventually see the Loser’s “core” personality and when they do, feel lucky to have survived the experience. If she makes a back burner contact however, you’ll see a different act, depending upon what is needed. Losers are social chameleons and can change their presentation depending upon what they want at the time.
I’ve always recommended a No Contact policy after the Loser is gone. I’ll stick by that in your situation. Dr. Carver
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