Comments on “Are You Dating a Loser?”
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82 Responses to “Are You Dating a Loser?”
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Hi folks,
Many thanks to everyone who has posted their thoughts and feelings and questions about Dr Carver’s article! We’ve now started a new discussion thread to accommodate even more feedback; please stop by there if you’d like to leave a question or comment for Dr Carver:
More Personal Replies from Psychologist About Relationships with Losers
All the best,
Greg -
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Dear Elle, The “Loser” I describe in my article can also be a parent, sibling, friend, etc. A parent with a severe personality disorder (Loser features) is very damaging to the children and spouse. Faced with a violent and controlling parent or spouse, people either detach for their own sanity (you), become an anxious wreck (mother), or adopt the characteristics of the abuser (your sibs). A group of “losers” creates a toxic family where there are no boundaries, a high tolerance for violence, drugs, and intimidation and a stance that you are either with-them or against-them. You are doing the right thing for you and your family, but it’s difficult. By the way, when we come from a toxic family we often select friends who are personality disorders. Why? Their behavior is familiar to us.
Keep on your path to health for your family. Dr. Carver -
Elle78
I decided this year to cut all contact with my father whom was involving my teenage son in drug taking as he did with me when i was 17. I learnt how to spot abusers early and at 21 met and married a lovely, gentle stable man who has supported me through 2 post natal depressions, we have been together for 21 yrs now. My father has a very violent history,at 74 he still uses drugs and laughs & boasts about the man he nearly killed when he was 60. What has sent me to the edge has been the reaction of my 3 siblings who said i was crazy and had lost the plot for making this desicion which i celarly said was about protecting my children. My brother who i thought was sensible has said that he wants no contact with me unless i reconcile with my Father. One of my sisters is an alchoholic and the other takes drugs and sees this as normal. Both have had violent partners and friends. My mother is a nervous wreck still, after many years of abuse by my father and i have been helping her to detach from the constant manipulation and guilt trips my siblings play to ‘rope us back in’ and pretend that we can all get along, that it is our duty to all get together for parties and functions. This family has no boundries and after reading your article it sounds like all my siblings are in the ‘loser’ category. Its hard hard work! i still get pulled back sometimes and cry and weep and fear for my sisters adn thier children. Even though I have created a much healthier family for myself, i find that i still attract freinds who are like my extended family also, but i am working hard to end this cycle of manipulating relationships. I have so much self esteem to rebuild.
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Dear Michelle & James: The Christian Bible says “Let your light shine before men”. When we’re in an abusive and controlling relationship - our inner and outer light begins to dim. We don’t smile, sing, laugh as much, or make eye contact. Those who love us see our light is going out but it takes a while before we notice it. I once had a patient walk to the office in a snow storm. Asked why, she said “I just noticed I’m walking with my head up. I wanted to enjoy the view.” Bad relationships change is in many ways, some very subtle.
As Michelle observed, recovery is also a time to redesign or customize your life. Detach from negative friends, repair damage to yourself and others, and build a stronger personality. Consider it an adventure rather than a difficult task.
I’d also mention that the appreciation of readers keep me writing. Many thanks. Dr. Carver -
James76
Michelle, I too feel better! Dr. Carver, I smile more, feel better about myself. My relationship with my children is improving. The change in me is a miracle. I never knew that life could be so good! Dr Carver, I will tell other people who might be in a relationship like this about your web site. I know it will help them.
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Michelle75
Thank you so much. I read your article about memory files and it’s been helping too. Sometimes, I forget to do some of the techniques, but I’m getting there. Certain older triggers are definitely being reworked.
People are starting to get the point that I don’t want to talk about my past experiences with the ex. I have a couple that I talk to with my concerns (my SO mainly, my mother second). The people who continually try to talk about things or say things that make me feel uncomfortable repeatedly I have been distancing from my life (by my own choice now and not from someone else telling me I should). Some, I’m dropping most (if not all) contact with for a period of time, as they are not helping my situation… and I’ve already talked to them about how certain things they said did hurt. If I’ve learned nothing else from my experience these past years and especially these past months, I have learned what friendship really is.
Thank you again. I look forward to reading more of your answers to the people who post here and hope to see more articles by you. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
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Dear Michelle, Welcome back to smiling! As you know, there is life after the end of a relationship with a Loser. You’ll find that most of your true friends were keeping their distance, like guardian angels, and waiting for you to return. For your total recovery, however, you want to disconnect yourself from any interest in his life. When people ask about your past relationship with the Loser - create a “press release” - a small paragraph that says the same thing (without personal information) to everyone. It doesn’t matter what he does now, only what you are doing with your new life.
You may have difficulty with the triggers, called “emotional memory”, as that occurs to anyone who has been in an emotionally traumatic experience. I have a handout on my website at http://www.drjoecarver.com to help manage those events. Keep smiling and looking ahead…don’t look back. Congrats on your recovery. Dr. Carver -
Michelle73
“My SO thinks he would, as I would.”
Sorry, that meant to read that “My SO thinks he would, and I believe the same.”
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Michelle72
Dr. Carver,
Thank you so much for the response. I’ve been working hard at repairing the damage to my esteem and ego, though I do recognize that there are still triggers (stupid stuff mostly… like going to the computer store and seeing the game section).
I also try to look at what I have now that I didn’t have before. My new relationship is everything I hoped my previous one would have been (and my SO has been very supportive through all this, having gone through similar, and knowing that my reactions are natural given everything), I have a better job and am living in a much better neighborhood, I have regained connection with my close friends who I lost touch with due to the manipulations (though I lost a number of friends due to the lies he spread about me… some of the people I reconnected with told me a number of the things he’s said and done), and I’m much more grounded. The changes have been so noticeable to everyone around me, ranging from the way I dress to my body language (apparently, I smile more). Everyone says they are happy I never married the guy and never got pregnant by him.
Shortly after my SO and I got engaged, my ex found out. He proposed to his girlfriend a few days later, having only started thinking about proposing after he heard about my engagement. He saw the pictures of the ring I had placed on my webpage, and bought her a larger one that I know he couldn’t possibly afford from the same store (I’m assuming he bought it on credit, though I am thinking more likely he had it put on her credit given his financial situation and his contemplating declaring “bankruptcy”. I know he didn’t have the ring when he proposed). At that point, he only knew her for 7 weeks, only dated her 6 weeks, and only saw her a few times a week for a few hours at the beginning of their relationship.
He then started posting to anywhere he could about the engagement, ommitting the fact they hadn’t dated or known eachother for more than two months, and also not telling a lot of people that it’s a “long engagement”. One person, he even told that it’s to “see if this is what they really want”, which seems to go against what most people see a proposal as. I know what a “long engagement” is to him, given he and I had one until I broke off the relationship. A number of people have been commenting to him about it, the hurried proposal, the plans for a long engagement (one mentioning that what he considers a long engagment is different than what people normally mean), his disappearing from their lives, and so on.
My mother wondered if I let out that I’m getting married in the next couple months (which I’m not), if he would try to push for a shorter engagement, maybe even an elopement. My SO thinks he would, as I would. But I don’t want to expend that energy on him like that, and I don’t want to force the new girl into that trap, which would be far more difficult to get out of than simply breaking up with him. I know he’s starting his pattern on her already, and isolating himself from the friends that he no longer has much use for (which I know he blamed me for when he did it last time). I believe she’s also pulling away, and he’s accusing a lot of people for saying things to ruin “the life he’s building for himself and the person he cares for” (which is a far cry from his “person I will love for all eternity” line he used repeatedly before).
So… the traits in your article continue in this situation. The fast engagement, the attempt to keep track of my life and maintain that bit of control (which he has no access to my personal sites anymore), making his current SO feel more insecure, the long engagement so he can “have his cake and eat it too”, and the attempt to one up me by giving her the things I wanted (but even bigger in some cases) and trying to go through mutual sources to get me to see this (but hasn’t been working too well for him).
I worry that he’ll try to contact me again. I almost hope he does, so I can say, “I thought I was dead to you, where’s my money?” I honestly don’t know if I’d bother answering though.
Thank you, Dr. Carver. Your article was incredibly helpful, to me and to the people I forwarded it to that were in a similar boat!
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Dear James, Thanks for your kind words of appreciation. As you discovered, people can recover from dysfunctional and even abusive relationships. I wish all the best to you and your children. Dr. Carver
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